WEBVTT

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后面我会快一点讲
I'll speak a little faster later.

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我相信前面我可能说的太慢了
I believe I may have spoken too slowly.

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首先最后这一部分是想跟大家一起探讨一下
First of all, the last part is to discuss with you.

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到底城市可以做些什么
What can the city do?

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首先是政府职能
The first is the function of government.

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我是觉得首先从政府过去的认识上
I think that first of all, from the past understanding of the government.

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我们始终都是把老年人当做一个需要特殊照料的群体
We always treat the elderly as a group in need of special care.

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他没有钱
He has no money.

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他低收入了是我们保证的对象
His low income is the object of our guarantee.

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他现在失能失智了
He is out of his mind now.

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照料不了了
Can't take care of it.

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是我们保证的对象
Is the object of our assurance

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但未来有可能从特殊群体的照料
But the future may come from the care of special groups.

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这个观点要更加转向成说你是60岁以上的
This view is even more important, steering said, you are over 60 years old.

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你就应该享有这个社会
You should enjoy this society.

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因为你积累了一一辈子对国家的贡献也好
Because you have accumulated a lifetime of contribution to the country.

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或者是经验也好
Or experience

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所以你应该享有一个普惠性的这样的一个服务的
So you should enjoy such a service of universality.

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所以减少行政的干预和加大政策的支持和引导的力度
Therefore, to reduce administrative intervention and increase policy support and guidance efforts.

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应该是未来发展的一个主要的方向
It should be a major direction for future development.

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再有就是制定城市养老服务设施的规划
Then there is the formulation of urban elderly services facilities planning.

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今天下午在讨论的时候
During the discussion this afternoon

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地产集团的老总说
Said the owner of the real estate group.

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他叫大家别跟他说
He told everyone not to tell him.

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他说这个规划是个无用的规划
He said the plan was a useless one.

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说是不能落地的
They say they can't land

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规划是给领导看的规划他只有指标
Planning is the planning for the leadership, he has only indicators.

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其实我不这样认为
In fact, I don't think so.

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就是进入了其中的几个规划
Is into a few of these plans.

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为什么你不这么认为
Why don't you think so?

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因为比如说我们像它有很多的内容
Because for example, we have a lot of content like it.

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比如说像我们可以看到目前的养老机构所在的位置
For example, we can see the current location of the elderly institutions.

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跟现在的居住用地和跟现在的老年人分布的密度之间的关系
The relationship between the present residential land and the present density of the elderly.

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是不是可以帮我们更好的去决定新增的养老机构应该去哪里
Is it possible to help us better to decide where the new old-age institutions should go?

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我觉得还是有帮助的
I think it's still helpful.

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那么另外在梳理的过程当中
So in the process of combing

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我们也会看到哪一些是有一定的违规
We will also see which ones are in violation of the law.

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它有没有存在下去的必要和可能性
Is it necessary and possible to exist?

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我们还可以看到目前的哪一些机构也许有符合设计合作再次开发的
We can also see which of the current agencies may be in line with the design of cooperation to re-develop.

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可能性
Possibility

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所以这个仍然是非常重要的基础
So this is still a very important foundation

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第三是建设老年宜居社区
The third is to build a livable community for the elderly.

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这里面既包括物质空间的一些规划的内容
This includes both material space and some of the planning content.

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我们说从土地上从开放空间上
We say from the land from the open space.

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从交通的无障碍上等等去做相应的
Do the right thing from the barrier of traffic, etc.

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但这也包括对不起
But that also includes sorry.

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也包括比如旧区改造
It also includes, for example, the transformation of old areas.

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而且是相当大量的一部分
And it's quite a lot of it

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我们说新建的要考虑
We said the new one should be considered.

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就既有的空间也是特别重要的
Even the existing space is also particularly important.

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那么再有还有一个很大的一个工作
Then there's another big job

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我觉得是一个社会服务规划
I think it is a social service planning

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这里既包括社区规划
This includes both community planning.

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也包括一些住房本身的开发的一些模式的引导
Also includes some housing itself development of some model guidance.

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同时也包括一些创新的内容在里头
At the same time, it also includes some innovative content.

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最后一部分我想它更多的是体现在政策层面上
The last part, I think, is more reflected in the policy level.

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更应该是一个政府区级的市级的相应的民政部门医疗卫生部门以及
More should be a government, district-level municipal corresponding civil affairs departments, medical and health departments as well.

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人口和老龄部门应该关注的
Population and ageing sectors

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第四部分是居住环境的适老化
The fourth part is the aging of the living environment.

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设计与改造
Design and transformation

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前面我们花了很多的时间都是在讨论这个问题
We spent a lot of time talking about this problem.

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但是还有太多的细节我们其实不可能一一涉猎到
But there are so many details that we can't really get one by one.

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但相应的内容像现在门口的无障碍的这个坡道我们在调查的时候
But the corresponding content, like the now accessible ramp at the door, when we were investigating.

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除了老年人会很关心说五层到六层没有电梯不怎么上去之外
Apart from the elderly will be very concerned about, say, five to six floors, no elevators do not go up very much.

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其实住在一楼的老年人如果使用轮椅
In fact, elderly people who live on the first floor use wheelchairs.

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他也常常面对出不来
He often can't face it.

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因为我们过去的楼房常常门口有3到4步台阶
Because we used to have three or four steps in front of the building.

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就室内和室外差有差不多60到90左右公分的这样的一个高差
The difference between indoor and outdoor is about 60 to 90 cm.

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所以这几步台阶也会难倒他
So these steps will knock him down

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他也会出不来
He won't be able to get out, either.

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其结果就是我们调研的时候真的会碰到常年不下楼的这样的老年人
The result is that when we do research, we really do not come across such old people.

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靠什么
On what?

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我们说当然要靠一些相应的技术规范和手段
We say, of course, we must rely on some corresponding technical norms and means.

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上面罗列的几个是现有的一些养老服务设施的专业制度化和设计标准
The above list is a few of the existing old-age services, professional institutionalization and design standards.

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下面是一些养老服务设施的建设标准
The following is the construction standard of some old-age service facilities.

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这些第一是不够
These first are not enough.

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第二就是常常他会面对的非常单不能叫单一
The second is that often he will face a very simple, not single.

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它是专属类的这样的一个养老服务设施所使用的一些规范
It is a category of such a pension service facilities used by some of the norms.

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我们现在正在着手制定其他的一些比较适合于普通住区的这个是老化
We are now working on the development of some of the other more suitable for ordinary settlements, this is aging.

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的规范
Norm

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那么我们住建部现在前面我提到的这样的一个工作组
Well, we have a working group like the one I mentioned earlier.

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那么实际上最后理出来了一共大概60项左右的是老性能的规范
Then in fact, the last out of a total of about 60 items is the old performance of the specifications.

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其中有通用性
It is universal.

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比如无障碍的等等
For example, the barrier-free, and so on.

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也有一部分针对单独的叫设施和不同的空间的
There are also some for individual facilities and different spaces.

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所以慢慢的会在未来的这年几年的时间里一点一点地去完善它
So it will gradually improve in the years to come.

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有很多的内容除了在我们目前的铸件口或者是规划规土口再坐
There is a lot of content except sitting at our current casting or planning pit.

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还有太多的东西是在相应的部门里正在完善
There are too many things that are being perfected in the corresponding departments.

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据我所知近期在老龄委的平台上
As far as I know, it has been on the platform of the commission recently.

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我看到的是有卫计委的就是卫生部的人
What I see is that the health department has the health care commission.

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他们正在做相应的评估
They are making a corresponding assessment.

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老年人健康状况的评估
Assessment of the health status of the elderly

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还有一些养老机构里边的一些相应的规范
There are some corresponding regulations in some old-age institutions.

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那么也可以看到建设部的我们这一部分人
Then we can also see the Ministry of construction of this part of the people.

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他正在做相应空间的一些是老化的空间的一些规范
He is doing some of the corresponding space is aging some of the space norms.

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我们甚至还看到了一些教育部的人
We even saw some people from the Ministry of education.

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教育部的人正在做相应的这种养老服务人员的一个叫评估
People in the Ministry of education are doing a corresponding assessment of the elderly service personnel.

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叫什么资格
What is your qualification?

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可能未来我们也会培养这样的人才做相应的这种定点
Perhaps in the future, we will train such people to do the corresponding point.

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所以不同的部门实际上都已经开始慢慢的进入到养老的整个大的平台
Therefore, different departments have in fact begun to slowly enter the pension of the entire large platform.

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那么未来应该有更多的系列化的这样的规范出台
In the future, there should be more serialization of such norms.

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我们只是能只是尽尽可能的希望所有的这些指标这么大量的指标在
We can only do as much as possible to hope that all of these indicators are such a large number of indicators in.

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出台的时候不要又形成新的混乱
Don't make a new mess when it comes out.

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B之间要协调
Coordination between B

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但问题在于当这么大量的指标要同时出台
But the problem is that when there are so many indicators to be published at the same time.

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假如不在一个口子出来的时候
If not at the time of the opening

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这中间恐怕总有一个前后衔接问题所带来的一些矛盾
I am afraid there will always be some contradictions arising from the problem of convergence.

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那么再有就是多样化的养老服务的体系
Then there is a diversified system of old-age services.

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我是在想一个成熟的市场
I'm thinking of a mature market.

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你的使用者和消费群体
Your users and consumers

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应该有他的选择的
There should be a choice.

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可能你要给他一个选择的自由
Maybe you should give him a choice.

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他有他的支付能力
He has his ability to pay.

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或者他愿意去某个城市
Or he would like to go to a city.

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他愿意拿这种形式来度过他的晚年
He is willing to spend his old age in this form.

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应该提供给他这种可能
Should provide him with this possibility.

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所以说为什么控制
So why control?

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我觉得其实在这个阶段上
I think actually at this stage

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对于商业模式的这一部分
For this part of the business model

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真的不用谈太多控制
Really don't have to talk about too much control

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好好的控制和管理一下
Have a good control and management.

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现在我们公里的这一部分
Now this part of our kilometer

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就这才是要务
That's what's important

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这三个有不同的类型
These three have different types.

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而上面就不管我们所提供的养老服务的产品是哪一种产品
And above, no matter what kind of products we provide for the elderly services.

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实际上都是这样三大类
In fact, there are three categories.

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一类面对的是失能失智的老人
One is faced with an elderly person who is mentally retarded.

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相对来说照料的程度比较深
The degree of care is relatively deep.

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那么它对应的用地更加向西五医疗卫生和西九二社会福利用地
Then it corresponds to the land more to the west five medical and health and west nine two social welfare land.

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那一类是建造中心助餐点
Which is the construction center meal

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这部分在社区里
This part is in the community

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它对应的用地是CC6用地
Its corresponding land is cc6 land.

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那么再一类就是城市社区里面的公共服务设施
Then another kind is the public service facilities in the urban community.

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它对
It's right

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可以是AMB可以是
Can be AMB can be

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CIAD但这是设想当中的
Ciad, but this is envisaged.

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事实上现在上海目前能够用作养老服务设施的用地只有两类
In fact, Shanghai can now be used for the elderly services facilities only two types of land.

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一类是C9
One is the C9.

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一个是2C6
One is 2c6

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其他的都不行
Nothing else will do

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说到这我们就说养老服务设施的建设也好
Speaking of which, we would say that the construction of old-age services is also good.

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就是老化的社区是老化的
Is that aging communities are aging

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住宅的建设也好
Housing construction is good.

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其实这里面背后都带有一个就是养老资源如何配置的问题
In fact, there is behind this is a pension resources how to allocate the problem.

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我们说养老本身资源的生产他不仅仅来自于国家
We say that the production of the endowment itself is not just from the country.

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也不仅仅来自于相应的部门
And not just from the departments

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在很大程度上还来自于一个熟人社会
To a large extent, it also comes from an acquaintance society.

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来自于你的家庭
From your family

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所以说非正式照料的这一块是不应该被忽视
Therefore, this piece of informal care should not be ignored.

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也就是家庭照料和社区的支持
Family care and community support

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在这两个层面上
On both levels

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我们规划的搞空间的这部分能够提供的支持就是要在内部室内做事
We plan to do space in this part of the support is to do things inside.

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老化的空间
Aging space

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让他能够尽可能延长仍然生活在自己家里的时间
To allow him to live as long as possible in his own home.

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以及尽可能延长他在社区里面能够得到的照料的时间和他留在社区
And extend as long as possible the care he can get in the community and his stay in the community.

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里面的机会
Inside opportunity

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再有的就是社会化的一些养老服务的供应商
Then there are socialized providers of some old-age services.

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可能对应的是一些养老地产
May be corresponding to some old-age real estate.

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哪一些比较社会化投资的养老服务的一个机构
What are some of the more socialized investments in pension services for an institution?

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再有一个就是政府的这一部分有基本养老的设施等等
Another is the government, this part of the basic pension facilities, and so on.

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所以左边的这一部分更加是对养老服务资源是如何生产出来的
So this part of the left is more on the old-age service resources are how to produce.

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右边的这一部分更加是怎么样把这部分生产出来的资源输送到现实的
On the right side of this part is how this part of the production of resources to the reality.

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空间当中去
Go in space

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让大家能够感受得到
So that you can feel it

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而所有的这些核心都在比如说应该是需求导向性的
And all of these core, for example, should be demand-oriented.

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所以回到最开始的这个话题
So back to the beginning

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我们说从认识上可能有一些认识是需要完善的
We say that there may be some knowledge that needs to be perfected.

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然后有一些相应的理念是需要建立的
Then there are some ideas that need to be built.

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不管是对我们规划工作者来说
For us planners

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还是在其他领域里边的其他的专家而言
Or other experts in other fields

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所以我们去年的时候
So when we were last year

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在建筑城规学院的平台上
On the platform of the building city school of planning

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我们成立了老龄社区研究中心
We set up a community research center for the aged.

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我们有英文叫他IPQ粒Tlet就
We have English to call him ipq pellet

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所以在这个基础上
So on this basis

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我们是有比较多的老师们参与
We have more teachers involved.

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可能目前有接近30位老师
There may be nearly 30 teachers at the moment.

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他们的背景是建筑的景观的规划的
Their background is the planning of the architectural landscape.

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社会学的医疗的
Sociological medical

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还有管理的机械的等等
And management machinery, and so on.

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所以如果我们是一个松散的一个合作的模式
So if we are a loose, cooperative model.

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我们摇动
We shake

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老师坐在这是我们这里面的中坚力量
The teacher sits here is the backbone of our society.

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对
Right

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我们是用这样的一个方式在设法去求解同一个问题
We are trying to solve the same problem in such a way.

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这个问题就是面对老龄化的城市
The problem is facing an aging city.

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我们是否已经准备好
Are we ready?

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谢谢大家
Thank you all